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Engine Stumbling - misfiring

27K views 36 replies 6 participants last post by  ragnabrok 
#1 · (Edited)
Short story, had the car, a 2016 forte5 SX for a year and a half. Runs great, decent fuel mileage. Got in a mostly cosmetic collision in october. Took it to the collision center. a week later i'm told the washer fluid reservoir is on back order for a month, and the can't release the car without it. Annoying, but it happens. they provided a loaner vehicle for the duration at least. A month later i'm told the part should be in the next day or so. 3 days later i get the call that the part is on back order another month... wonder if they ordered the wrong part? Any way, Dec 22 i get the car back.

Headlights are pointing all over the place, but the bodywork is good. A few days later i start it in the cold, and go back inside to let it warm up, and i hear it banging and stumbling, the roar up to 2200 rpm, an settle down to a stumbly idle. Car has ~36K Km's on it

next cold start i record it, same deal. start it, runs normalish for almost exactly a minute, CEL comes on, rpms drop below 200, engine bangs and shakes the whole car a couple times, screams up to 2200 rpm and levels off again. OBD shows misfires on all the cylinders.

Take it to the dealer with the CEL still on, they disappear into the back for a few hours, come back and tell me nothing is wrong, maybe some water in the fuel lines. Ran some water remover in the next tank, seemed better. unit a month later it does it again. Fuel consumption is ridiculous at this point. 1/2 tank, 20 ish liters to drive 180 km of 90% highway driving. thats over 11L/100km. Last winter it was in the high 7's low 8's on the highway.

Go back to dealer, but the CEL had turned itself off at this point, they tell me "light not on, can't do anything" they literally do nothing, not even pop the hood and send me off.

Any idea what's going on, or why the dealer won't do anything?

https://youtu.be/7Gd6yiHWscc Magic happens around the 1 minute mark.
 

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#2 ·
One minute is just about how long it takes for the engine to go CL, so it's probably some issue related to one of the sensors that participates in CL, or perhaps a vacuum line. And there's also a good chance it's related to the work the body shop did. So take a look at all of the ground connections, wiring, sensor connectors, and vacuum tubing anywhere near the area of the body damage. It also might be helpful to gently push on everything in the engine bay that moves, during the time the engine is stumbling. A realtime OBD data stream scanner might be a big help in pinpointing the problem, if you can't find it with a visual inspection.

It comes as no surprise to me that the stealership wasn't able to do anything. Take it to a good independent shop if you're unable to find the answer yourself.
 
#4 · (Edited)
CL is an abbreviation for Closed Loop. And the pics won't help anyone else with this because you need to be hands-on the vehicle, looking for whatever is wrong from the list of things I mentioned previously. And the actual problem is more likely something the body shop didn't do correctly, rather than from the damage itself. Things such as failure to reconnect ground wires tight is what you're looking for. If you can't identify the problem yourself, then take it to an independent shop.
 
#5 ·
The errors point towards the engine management. I agree with kiaguy007, start with ground wires missing, or no longer grounded, because of the spray paint, that will be a promising start. After that, I'd move on to look for any plugs, which have been left unplugged, especially air mass meter and lambda probe. (I do not know, where your damage was. Also, check fuses and relays related to engine management. Normally, they'd disconnect the battery, but what if they did not?
 
#6 ·
I wish I could get a hold of your broken headlight and fog light... I am getting ready for retrofit and need some broken headlights.


Regarding your issue.

Sure, check for ground, but honestly I do not that is the issue here. But then again - check wires going to the engine and around. From your damage it does not seem they should mess up with anything there at all.
However... read below.

A few questions first.
Once it goes back to normal, how does it behave then?
Does it have power as it used to?

You started int cold. How cold was it? About -5C? I did not hear the BOV venting, but could be hindered by other noises.

Since it is MT, when you are driving and say in 3rd gear, at 35 km/h, floor it - does it pool nicely? Engine of course at operating temp.
It should pull quite hard and have power till no less but 5500 rpm. Then stock tune tapers off a bit.

What I am leaning towards is spark plugs - that is one thing.
The other would be intercooler piping. They shoould not need to touch anything, but who knows.

They removed bumper for sure. I wonder if they put everything back as it supposed to be. You would feel power problems right away, I guess, but since your are saying it gives good fuel economy, I feel like you do not push it too much.


Last thing - coils. Some complained about them failing. I also experience rough idle, but nowhere near yours, at cold. Until the engine is fully warmed up, it acts funny. Although I am running a tune with 93 octane. Still, stock was funny.

I would remove all 4 spark plugs and check them.
As for your dealer - yeah, some of them are not so good. I am very sorry to hear yours is the bad one. I had those too in my life.


You might want to visit http://www.forteturbo.org as they have more experience with SX version.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Updating as I go.

Had a good look under the hood today, pulled on every connection i could reach.

image 1, engine oil coming down the intake, just above the air filter. seems to originate from a short hose leading to the top of the engine. PCV valve?

images 2 + 3, a small hose with "fuel vapour" printed on it seems like it should be more connected than it is (it's got pink paint on it for some reason) it appears to be a smaller hose wrapped in a larger one. the larger one is in 2 segments, with a gap exposing the smaller one inside. it looks like that crimp is supposed to hold them together. I pulled on it a bit, but the hoses didn't want to easily come back together, so i left it.
@PLP
Once it goes back to normal, how does it behave then?
it seems normal after a few minutes of idling. once at operating temp it idles around 850

Does it have power as it used to?
Seems unchanged, but the roads are still slippy, it breaks traction long before i can floor it.

You started int cold. How cold was it?
-17C in the video

You would feel power problems right away, I guess, but since your are saying it gives good fuel economy, I feel like you do not push it too much.
It gives horrific fuel economy, 11L/100km on the highway. prior to this it would be around 8 in the winter for highway driving.

I've got an appointment on monday with the only other KIA dealer locally, maybe they'll be more helpful. If i get the same brush off i'll find an independent shop.
 

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#8 ·
image 1, engine oil coming down the intake, just above the air filter. seems to originate from a short hose leading to the top of the engine. PCV valve?
Normal, although I hate it, because oil vapours then are being dragged down into the intake, then onto the turbine plates, where it gets heated, then onto the hot pipe and to the intercooler. Not much can be done except oil catch can. Or leave it, let KIA deal with some issues at some point (warranty claim).

images 2 + 3, a small hose with "fuel vapour" printed on it seems like it should be more connected than it is (it's got pink paint on it for some reason) it appears to be a smaller hose wrapped in a larger one. the larger one is in 2 segments, with a gap exposing the smaller one inside. it looks like that crimp is supposed to hold them together. I pulled on it a bit, but the hoses didn't want to easily come back together, so i left it.

I am not sure, but appears to be normal. I need to check mine.
The markings are from factory. They mark all clamps to see if anything moved or slid off.

-17C in the video
That explains the low idle. I noticed that mine does same thing - on very cold, like -17 C, it would quickly drop. When it is warmer (-5 to +5), it takes more time to stabilise and you hear the turbo spool, blow off vent a lot.

It gives horrific fuel economy, 11L/100km on the highway. prior to this it would be around 8 in the winter for highway driving.
They are known for very bad fuel economy in cold.
Stock tune runs very rich. Also, your idling (warm up) is definitely not helping...



My experience:
I never let it idle this long on cold. Maybe once, or twice, but hard to say what temp it was.
I would always, when at -20 C or so, start it, let it idle for 10-15 seconds and take off. Basically, allow the idle to stabilise, or for BOV to close. I don't let it warm up...
However, it would have some stumble about 30 seconds from the moment I took off. It was almost always in the same spot on the street. It felt like it was misfiring, or not sure how much fuel to give.

Sure, it looks like switching from Open Loop to Closed Loop (as mentioned before - oxygen sensor driving the Air Fuel Ratio, on open loop ECU has preset values).
And while now (currently I have AT, I sold the MT...) I cannot feel it this much as AT hinders many problems, I can still feel a bit of hesitation. Then it is gone.


I would suggest you to leave the car overnight, get a loaner from them, and come back the next day morning. Start the car with them and let them witness the issue.
You MUST be there, otherwise they will not do it, or will say - they could not duplicate the issue.
 
#9 ·
I can't get rid of the feeling that something is causing closed loop processing to go haywire, resulting in a rich running condition. Then the upstream O2 sensor does it's thing, levels it out to just somewhat rich, making it seem like it's running ok. However, the increased fuel usage is the smoking gun that provides evidence that it continues to run abnormally rich.

With the physical inspection not helping, I'd be using an OBD realtime data steam reader to try for additional information, but it sounds like you're not up for that type of DIY. Well, perhaps the second stealership can do better than the first one did, but typically if GDS doesn't hand them the answer, they just throw in the towel and give up. But who knows, maybe they'll prove me wrong about that, and for your sake I hope that's the way this one goes.
 
#10 ·
Not that i'm unwilling for some DIY, especially if i actually get results instead of being shown the door, i'm more lacking in tools and familiarity. I have a cheapo OBD2 bluetooth reader, but most of what it can read doesn't help me much. it gets a voltage reading from an O2 sensor, but i have no idea what that voltage indicates, or what it should or shouldn't be. Also, without a schematic of the engine, i couldn't find that sensor if I tried looking for it.
 
#11 ·
....I have a cheapo OBD2 bluetooth reader, but most of what it can read doesn't help me much. it gets a voltage reading from an O2 sensor, .....
So this reader doesn't display fuel trims? Voltage can be useful when trying to figure out O2 sensor errors, but isn't helpful when you're interested in watching fuel trims. Also I believe that seeing the temp and MAP sensor values might be very helpful for your problem, so the tool should do that as well. All of those things are basic functionality, so I'm wondering if perhaps what you have has some options that you're not aware of?
 
#12 · (Edited)
So get your cheap Bluetooth OBDII and get Android app Torque (Lite free or Pro for 5 USD) and see the fuel trims. Stock is set around 9-11. It DOES run rich...


EDIT.

Not sure what your trip is, but keep in mind that when you start the engine at -17 C it will be drinking initially about 4 l/h, then it drops to about 2 l/h, to finally reach level of about 1.3 l/h (liter per hour) when at operating temperature. Idle speed should be about 700-750 rpm or slightly below.
So if your trip is say 17 km, if you had 8 l/100 km previously that means you would use 1.36 l, with current 11 l/100 km, you use 1.87. The difference is about 15 minutes of cold idle...

Another thing to look could be leaking thermostat. It should hold no less than 80-82 C when driving.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Casual observation, I drove to a store, about a 20 minute trip. When i got there i pulled 2nd gear, floored it on cold wet road and it accelerated, but not aggressively. Left the store about half hour later, floored it in 2nd on the same road i did coming in and it almost instantly wheel hopped. it's such a huge difference in power for no apparent reason.

Attached is a snap from the ODB reader in torque. from the top left lists, Air/fuel mix, RPM, 02 bank 1, another 02 bank 1, manifold vacuum, water temp, short term fuel trim 1, and as listed fuel flow.

One is after starting it when it sat for just under 3 hours, the other after driving about 20 minutes.

https://imgur.com/a/7Q8SZ
 
#14 ·
I had been thinking it would be more important to see the readings as the problem started happening during startup. But in looking a what you posted, those vacuum readings look way too low, almost like they're actually PSI instead of in/HG. But if those values are correct, it would be likely there's a vacuum leak - perhaps something the body shop didn't reconnect correctly, or accidentally damaged.
 
#15 ·
I would say vacuum looks OK.
@kiaguy007, those are at idle (fuel flow is minimal), also this being MT there is no load to the engine.
I have a mechanical boost gauge. At idle it gets to about -12 to -10, when coasting in gear I can reach as low as -20 in Hg.

20 minutes trip so the engine must have been hot enough to allow all power. Until coolant is at at least 70 deg C (operating temp is 82) ECU limits boost and how quickly the boost builds up. At anything below 50 deg C you barely get 5 psi... even with tune :(

What I find weird is the AFR being stoichiometric...

Anyway, since you have Torque running, upload your log file to http://datazap.me/
For some more info, you can read here: https://torque-bhp.com/

Get AFR, coolant temp, boost, ignition (timing), throttle position (you can do both: pedal and throttle - sometimes they differ...), RPM, and car speed (from ECU).

When you floored it for the first time, did you hear any knocks, did a cloud of smoke appear?
I noticed in mine that if I do not push it from time to time and keep driving it civil (how can you drive it civil for too long?) meaning gentle shifts, half throttle, then when I push it at some point it may hesitate. I "clear" it a few times and it somehow goes fine.
I am thinking it could be something related to oil getting from PCV. You had the car sitting for long, plus it is cold.
 
#16 ·
I would say vacuum looks OK.....
I'm not that familiar with the second gen, and didn't realize (until I just checked), that the only engine option for the SX is a turbo. So, being boosted, I'm sure you're right about the vacuum readings. Guess I need to be more careful about making comments about stuff I'm less familiar with :wink2:
 
#18 ·
Just an editorial comment that it's nice to see someone with professional expertise show up here and be willing to give free advice to others. It's too bad that these auto forums have so little DIY activity going on these days, resulting in quality members dropping out of boredom. My understanding is that just about all of the DIY has moved to social media (which I don't care to use). But anyway, glad to have you aboard for however long you chose to stay :wink2:
 
#19 · (Edited)
OK, first of all thanks to you awesome people for sticking around in this thread!

Ran torque yesterday with screen recording. Same monitors as the previous pictures.

First up, cold start. Left it overnight and fired it up. you can't hear or see it, but it's intermittently shaky, Everything is turned off, radio, HVAC, heated anything.
https://youtu.be/lJIKoTw7M88

Next we have on the highway after ~30 minutes of driving. holding 110 km/h with cruise control in 6th.
https://youtu.be/CoZAtEchQI4

and also after about 30 mins of driving, turning onto the highway, pulling 3rd gear from ~30 KM/h to ~110, pedal as far down as i can mash it.
https://youtu.be/Ln-udQqQCcg

And you are right, it does go from in/Hg to PSI from vacuum to boost.
 
#20 ·
A few things.
I can hear troubles at 0:26 - look on fuel flow and AFR. It is very hard trying to get it in shape, but struggles. It did not die, lie last time.
What worries me is the vacuum reading. You had it at -19.2 in the other screen while on the main it is -9.5 (about 1:50).
Besides, mine when start reads about 0.00 for vacuum/boost until rpm drops a bit and I can hear the BOV venting a lot. Can you hear that too? It does not seem to be doing it.
Then, later on it runs relatively fine, I would say. Definitely the switch from cold oxygen sensor to hot (open closed loop).

Take the video to the dealer.


As for the rest.
Steady sounds OK

Under WOT (wide open throttle) I see weird things.
You do not reach stock boost that should be about 18 psi max. Sure, most of the time I would be hitting 16, but you barely hit 14 psi in mid range. It tapers off in higher band, but the low end should be 16-18 psi under metal to metal.


I assume you are the first owner, right? No parts were changed?
 
#21 ·
Yup, first owner. The only thing not from the factory in this car is the gas, oil and air filter, though the air filter is OEM. It's completely stock.

It's in the dealer right now, and I've given all the info I have, videos included.

Good catch on that other vacuum gauge, I'll compare that when I get the car back.
 
#22 ·
I forgot to say that - fuel flow. See when it switches from about 4 l/h to 2 l/h? (gallon/hour)
That is the very moment it is stumbling. But why would it still show measured AFR being 14.5? No clue... it should not read anything until the sensor is hot, or get the more true reading of very rich on cold.

Please update what the dealer said.
 
#23 ·
Well, at least this dealer took it inside. I'm told they removed the spark plug wires and looked at the coils. They apparently found standing water in the plug wells, and dried them out. Other than that they confirm it had error codes, but currently doesn't and is running fine. No vacuum issues, normal fuel consumption. mm hmmm...

Changed the units in torque to metric, and have the vacuum always in PSI, not convert to in/hg when in vacuum, and it warm idles at ~ -9 PSI, and in a spirited 3rd gear pull did hit 16 PSI boost.

It's supposed to drop to -12C tonight, so i'll check the vacuum again with a cold start, i'll also have some 100km+ highway driving on thursday and can check consumption again, but i get the feeling there hasn't been standing water in the plug wells since december.
 
#25 · (Edited)
They apparently found standing water in the plug wells, and dried them out.
How long have you been driving with this damage before getting the car fixed?
Also, do you have the engine cover on? I cannot say from the pictures.

The standing water explains a lot. That was the problem.
It was purely misfiring. I had this happened to my other car, but that was after I washed engine... and sprayed too much of water on it.

I guess in your case, if you were driving it for a while you could have scooped some water/snow and got it condensed there. Also, the body shop could have washed the engine or left the hood up.


AFR now is much lower, which is more normal.
Still vacuum is different, but what fuel do you use? Regular 87 octane? Yet, that is not something I would worry about too much.

You hit 16 psi, that means engine is fine.


at 50+ C it should be warm enough to run at 14.7:1 air/fuel, no?
Nope, you would not be hitting 14.7. Turbo'ed cars run rich, meaning below 14.6. According to tuner they run at 12... which I find weird because none of my logs supported that.
I will dig into it at some point.


EDIT:

A cold start, kind of cold - after about 7 hours sitting outside at about +4 deg C. Engine is at about +10 deg C.
There is a background noise from the building behind, but you can clearly see the boost gauge staying at 0 (give or take a few psi) and dropping to deep negative side at about 0:45.
I pushed the gas a few times in between (quick tap) to show how the pressure changes.

https://youtu.be/6BZ05Qwh5O4

I found some older one with very cold start. You can hear the BOV venting as well.

https://youtu.be/7a1sf3PSw7w
 
#24 ·
Ok 2 more. For reference, this is the OBD2 reader i'm using http://a.co/7VKKnna along with torque pro.

Added air/fuel mix commanded, and switched the vacuum to stay in PSI instead of convert to IN/hg. The dial that was reporting -19.5 when the others were at -9 seems to be an anomoly, it was the only one that didn't match the others.

Cold start - https://youtu.be/p6u9T24LpvU - around -10 C with the window open, and again, no hvac or radio or heated seats on.

Vacuum doesn't sit at 0, nor do i really hear a bov venting at any point. the commanded air/fuel mix stays pretty rich. near the end of the video i get out and walk around to the exhaust.

warmish start - https://youtu.be/4hQEsgbDjsY

basically stopped the engine after the previous video for 30 seconds and started it again. idle RMP lowered, at 50+ C it should be warm enough to run at 14.7:1 air/fuel, no?
 
#26 ·
How long have you been driving with this damage before getting the car fixed?
Also, do you have the engine cover on? I cannot say from the pictures.
The first time the CEL came on, and it rattled like in the first video, i made a service appointment. they got me in a few days later. The engine cover is on, the only time i've seen it come off is when one of the service guys popped it off to look at the connections.

Still vacuum is different, but what fuel do you use? Regular 87 octane? Yet, that is not something I would worry about too much.
yeah 87.

Odd, before the 2nd dealer claimed to have discovered the water, it was 14.7:1 AFR in all the videos.

I took it on the highway today, and some conspiracy level stuff is going on now. In the city, the L/100km guage very closely matches the fuel flow. At highway speeds however, it differs dramatically, with the car display being much lower.

at 100/KMH, with cruise on, on flat road, the car displays ~7L/100KM, both the instant, and if i reset the average. The OBD reads 10-11 (it bouces around)
at 115 km/h, with cruise on a flat road again, car displays 8-9. OBD reads 12-13.

https://imgur.com/a/Qli4d Pictures taken one after the other.

Maybe coincidental, but seems like they heard my complaint of bad fuel economy, and fudged it so at least the display shows a more pleasing number. But it's showing better fuel efficiency than it was achieving last summer.

I haven't washed my engine, and I dont think the body shop did either, there were still leaves lower in the engine bay.
 
#27 ·
The first time the CEL came on, and it rattled like in the first video, i made a service appointment. they got me in a few days later.
I meant the accident... how long it took before you left the car with the body shop. I am just thinking if snow somehow did not find a way into the engine bay through missing fog light.

at 100/KMH, with cruise on, on flat road, the car displays ~7L/100KM, both the instant, and if i reset the average. The OBD reads 10-11 (it bouces around)
at 115 km/h, with cruise on a flat road again, car displays 8-9. OBD reads 12-13.

The instrument cluster gauge shows fuel economy in liters/100 km, while Torque displays fuel flow, in liters/h. Also, my calculations show that the cars gauge is about 10% off, using USA units. Not sure if that would translate into 10% in metric, the only correct, units. Car shows say 7 l/100 km, while the real one is 7.7 l /100 km.

So, at 115 km/h you get say 8 l/100 km, while fuel flow is 12 l/h. That means in one hour you use 12 l to drive 115 km, 12/115*100=10.4 l/100 km.
Torque uses weird algorithm and it was way off in my car, too. It would show very inaccurate numbers.


Did you see my start videos? Have you ever heard this sound?
 
#31 ·
Kia Forte Investigation

The law firm of Migliaccio & Rathod LLP currently has an open investigation into the knocking noise found in certain Kia and Hyundai engines. If you would like to learn more about this investigation, please Google "Migliaccio & Rathod Kia" and you'll find their information on their blog. I am unfortunately unable to share the link on this post.

The firm's contact information is found in the link, but I'll write it here for your convenience.
Phone: (202) 470-3520
 
#32 ·
The law firm of Migliaccio & Rathod LLP currently has an open investigation into the knocking noise found in certain Kia and Hyundai engines. If you would like to learn more about this investigation, please Google "Migliaccio & Rathod Kia" and you'll find their information on their blog. I am unfortunately unable to share the link on this post.

The firm's contact information is found in the link, but I'll write it here for your convenience.
Phone: (202) 470-3520
Dear J. Rathod,
I am not sure which exactly engine you are investigating, but 1.6T is not shared across the models listed at your site. Elantra just got it now (2018), Sonata Eco had 1.6T, rest are 2.4 or 2.0T, Fortes are 1.6T, 1.8, 2.0, and others include 2.4 as well.

  • Hyundai Elantra
  • Hyundai Santa Fe
  • Hyundai Sonata
  • Kia Forte
  • Kia Optima
  • Kia Sorrento
  • Kia Sportage
So it would be nice to be more specific what you are looking into and what exact engines are the scope of your investigation.
 
#33 ·
Bump, issue still on going, if not getting worse. Trying another round at the stealership to see if they actually want to fix something under warranty, or if all those posters on the walls are just for show.

Whole bunch of fun stuff lately, same stumbling on cold starts sometimes, but now it'll stall after running for ~45 seconds sometimes as well. seems worse when it's been plugged in. Watching what i can see on torque over obd2, the vacuum plummets when it's stumbling, not sure if that's the cause or the result. the throttle goes up to around 50% during this as well, and if anything causes it to stumble even more. It's held around 300 rmp for a good 10 seconds before stalling even just this morning.

Had it on the highway last week, sounds like the BPV isn't opening between shifts, makes a muffled groan like a baloon deflating more than a PSSHH. felt like it was lugging as well, like if you floored it in gear at 700 rpm, it'll moan and vibrate... but it was at ~2500 rpm.

had a few instances of something that felt like wheel hop, but barely on the throttle, just crawling in traffic. happens intermittently, and only ever low speed clutch engagement, givin' er a bit off the line doesn't cause this.

also had a few times under traffic crawl acceleration things are normal, but when a path opens up and i give it just normal amounts of throttle, it slowed down.

Been cold lately, i'm sure some of this is attributed to that, or at least exasperated by it, but it's still running pretty badly.

stealership thursday, i'd imagine more shrugged shoulders and nothing being done.
 
#34 ·
Since you mentioned your BOV, I just had to replace mine. I had a CEL and when I took off the BOV, it had a tear in it. I replaced it, but still had the same problem of the CEL and I could hear the BOV fluttering when I shifted. I have a new RCV solenoid valve arriving today and I'll install that, which I hope solves my problem. The big difference between your problem and mine is that my car runs fantastic, better than ever at 96k miles.
 
#35 ·
Actually cold makes my car even more aggressive.


I feel like we should go back to the basics.
Start with fuel flow, coils, and spark plugs.
Then all vacuum lines, BOV, turbo pipes (clamps, tears...).



Also, I would actually invest in a mechanical vacuum/boost gauge. It is much faster in response and shows ACTUAL values, not processed by ECU.
Something like that.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00UM9X2HW/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1


That may actually help a lot.


For the logs - boost requested vs provided, same for air/fuel ratio. We are missing something here and I bet it is a simple thing.




A long time ago I had a car that was missing under light throttle. It would idle OK, it would go fine WOT, but light steady throttle would miss and jerk.
Spent several days in the shop, took to another one where some great computer guys tested it. Nothing was wrong, yet everyone could feel the issue.
All checked out fine.


Until I finally took the book, went through all the setup, and sure enough - one stupid switch was intermittently working. It would miss ground from time to time and would cut off fuel.
It was a 1997 car with electronically controlled carburetor with cat converter. Not as complicated as 1.6T-GDI, but still.


The point is - had we gone through the very basics in the beginning, it would have been solved right away.






EDIT.
I was trying to think what the shop did.
Possible some grounds are missing or were disconnected and then put back on on the painted surface without cleaning off the paint?
The passenger side corner - there is not much of mechanical related to the turbo/fuel.
But are ground points.
Further down you have wastegate controls and vacuum lines.
 
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