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Hey can anyone that's done their own oil changes help me out...Was planning on doing my own oil change...What is the size of the ratchet socket for the oil pan nut???? Would rather know before I go out in the freezing cold trying to fumble around with it....Any help is greatly appreciated...Thanks...
 

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What engine do you have although I'm not sure it would make any difference if the block is the same? Unless I am badly mistaken this engine is identical to the one in my 2009 Sonata. It's was about a five minute procedure. I believe the oil plug takes 14 mm.

In the Sonata there was an access hole in the plastic engine cover on the bottom so I merely put a long extension up there and got the filter loose and then loosened it up by hand. The factory oil filter is different than the dozen or so filter tools I have but I finally located one that gripped it and took it off.

I replaced the oil with 5w-20 oil meeting factory specs and put a Wix filter on it that I got from NAPA and purchased the proper filter tool fitting that filter.

What I did was to put the car up on metal ramps but I'm wondering if a person couldn't simply jack it up on each side of the front and put large blocks under the wheels to gain access.

A couple of those cheap 2 ton jacks at Wal-Mart work just fine. They were on sale for $19 each (regularly $25). Someone suggested using hockey pucks to cushion the jack points and put on top of the jacks so it won't stress the body. I haven't done that but it is probably a good idea.

With the ramps it is difficult to clear the bottom valance so you need to be careful not to damage that. I placed a 2x6 board in front of the ramps to clear the valance and carefully put the car in the trough on the ramp. There was plenty of clearance to change out the oil and filter.

This only applies if the engine and access are identical to the Sonata which I suspect it is. If not anyone can correct me.
 

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Ok, first off I gotta comment on the hockey puck idea... that's precious. Um.. let's put it nicely and just say "that's not required as long as you jack on something stable". A good suggestion is to jack on the subframe at any point... but avoid the control arms, and any tie-rods, steering linkage, sway bar, etc. Chances are that if you don't know what the difference between a subframe and a control arm, you should NOT be changing your own oil. A hockey puck isn't going to make any difference at all, other than make you look silly to anyone who asks what you're doing.

The drain plug is 17mm. Hyundai does use a 14mm, but all Kias are universally 17mm since '02.

There is a whole ton of room around the oil filter to reach up and grab it with your hand. No cut out, no access hole. The Forte has a lot less undercar plastics than a lot of other cars, so nothing really in your way. The catch is that it IS a bit of a wider filter, and you WILL need pliers/claw/band wrench/etc to remove it if it's your first service. Filters are put on 'dry' at the factory and they are sticky as hell to get off. Trying by hand is an exercise in futility for most people. The Kia filter is 3 1/4" wide, so make sure your tool can manage it.

When tightening the drain plug use a fresh aluminum washer and tighten to hand tight, plus about 1/8 - 1/6 of a turn to snug it down. This isn't a competition to see who can squeeze the snot out of the washer, it's just tight enough to 'seat' it and let it do it's job. I find a 1/4 turn is way too much... just snug it up.

Otherwise... make sure you put oil back in (that's funny, because it happens a LOT) and don't slop it over the back of the engine on into the plug's well... again, happens a lot.

You'll find that a full change with filter will take about 3.5 - 4 quarts, depending on how long you wait for it to finish draining. If you need to put more than 4 quarts then check your drain plug and your counting - that oil's going somewhere 'else' or it's maybe just not flowing down into the pan as fast as you're pouring it into the top.
 

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Ok, first off I gotta comment on the hockey puck idea... that's precious. Um.. let's put it nicely and just say "that's not required as long as you jack on something stable". A good suggestion is to jack on the subframe at any point... but avoid the control arms, and any tie-rods, steering linkage, sway bar, etc. Chances are that if you don't know what the difference between a subframe and a control arm, you should NOT be changing your own oil. A hockey puck isn't going to make any difference at all, other than make you look silly to anyone who asks what you're doing.

The drain plug is 17mm. Hyundai does use a 14mm, but all Kias are universally 17mm since '02.

There is a whole ton of room around the oil filter to reach up and grab it with your hand. No cut out, no access hole. The Forte has a lot less undercar plastics than a lot of other cars, so nothing really in your way. The catch is that it IS a bit of a wider filter, and you WILL need pliers/claw/band wrench/etc to remove it if it's your first service. Filters are put on 'dry' at the factory and they are sticky as hell to get off. Trying by hand is an exercise in futility for most people. The Kia filter is 3 1/4" wide, so make sure your tool can manage it.

When tightening the drain plug use a fresh aluminum washer and tighten to hand tight, plus about 1/8 - 1/6 of a turn to snug it down. This isn't a competition to see who can squeeze the snot out of the washer, it's just tight enough to 'seat' it and let it do it's job. I find a 1/4 turn is way too much... just snug it up.

Otherwise... make sure you put oil back in (that's funny, because it happens a LOT) and don't slop it over the back of the engine on into the plug's well... again, happens a lot.

You'll find that a full change with filter will take about 3.5 - 4 quarts, depending on how long you wait for it to finish draining. If you need to put more than 4 quarts then check your drain plug and your counting - that oil's going somewhere 'else' or it's maybe just not flowing down into the pan as fast as you're pouring it into the top.

Reading from my 2011 Kia owner's manual it states: "Engine oil (drain and refill with oil filter") 4.5 U.S. quarts, API Service SM. (same as my Sonata)

Now I NEVER said I changed the oil in my Kia 2.4. However, unless appearances are greatly deceiving the engines in my Kia and Hyundai side by side appear identical. I believe, in fact, that they are the same engine.

I state categorically, without equivocation, and contradiction, that if one drives their vehicle up on the metal ramps and loosens the drain plug that five quarts will drain out of the oil pan. No ifs, ands, or buts. (on the 2.4 engine) ON A LEVEL SURFACE, such as is the norm in most service bays it is PROBABLE that 1/2 of a quart of oil stays in the bottom of the oil pan. At the angle I drained the oil more oil drains out; a total of 5 quarts. How do I know this? Because EXACTLY five quarts go into the engine to bring the oil level up to the full mark of the oil dip stick. Since I changed oil in both my 2008 and 2009 Sonatas, and can therefore eliminate the oil dipsticks as defective, and both of them exactly came to the full mark, I believe that a full drain will yield EXACTLY five quarts of oil.

Now as to hockey puck, I haven't actually done that. Let me explain for the imagination challenged person who might not understand this. IF the puck is grooved in the center of the puck it yields a considerably larger surface area than does the area that would otherwise contact the jack points sans the hockey puck. One does not jack on control arms and the like; nor have I ever suggested doing this. Having said this, I have yet to notice any dimpling of the metal when I have jacked up either of the Sonatas to rotate my tires. It is probably unnecessary but I think worthy of consideration. I've seen rocker panels buckled because of lazy and irresponsible mechanics in a hurry which is one reason I tend to want to do it myself. And then when you take it back to the dealer try to convince him that the damage was done there. Good luck!

As to the drain plug, that is (DEFINITELY) true (regarding the 14mm and 17mm sizes) although I haven't actually changed the oil in my Forte since it only has about 700 miles on it. It (DEFINITELY) does have a 17 mm socket that needs to be employed. I have such a tool in my $5,000 tool set somewhere.

As to the oil filter, it is TRUE that the factory filter is wider and uses a Hyundai/Kia filter wrench to loosen it. However, if one puts a WIX filter on it, one of which of many which will fit these cars, use the one that the parts dealer will sell to fit it. That's what I did. Since I have subsequently had the dealer change the oil during the oil change special days costing $19.95 which is probably cheaper than I can buy the parts myself naturally they use the factory filter. When I change my own oil I use the WIX filter. At that point I have to use the universal fram filter contraption to get the factory filter loose.

I DO NOT use a new plug gasket. I asked the parts manager at NAPA about this and he saw no need for one and in fact I have never used a new one. I torque it down to factory specs and have yet to see a leak on my garage floor. But based on your personal experience I will be sure to stock up on such crush gaskets in the future although my personal experience is that never in my lifetime of dozens of oil changes have I ever changed such a gasket unless it was obviously damaged. But it can't hurt to change it since the cost can't be particularly significant to one's financial standing. So I will defer to your expertise in this regard.

I still believe the hockey puck is probably a good idea and one I intend to try out to avoid the somewhat difficult ramp arrangement. If the groove is put exactly in the center and indentations are made on the dimpled jack points of the jack it should fit snugly and provide less square inches of pressure applied at the jack points. (think of high heel shoes on linoleum floors - what do they do?) It certainly can't hurt. When I have used wood to distributed the weight, invariably the wood splinters so when I saw the hockey puck suggestion put forward I thought it worthy of mention. Not everyone has access to ramps nor a local dealer to change their oil. But I strongly suspect that it would be easy to get at the filter of either factory filter or after market filter (meeting factory specs of course) and do it themselves. It is no big deal. A question was asked and I gave my views.
 

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Why are you saying probably needs a 17mm? If Kiatech states it needs that size then it does need that size since he is an actual technician at Kia and works on these cars daily.
 

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Why are you saying probably needs a 17mm? If Kiatech states it needs that size then it does need that size since he is an actual technician at Kia and works on these cars daily.
Has everyone gotten up on the wrong side of the bed? If he says it takes a 17mm size it DEFINITELY takes a 17mm size. For crying out loud!! Can we all take a pill and cool down?

I guess I need to get out the dictionary (and professional proof reader) to ensure I don't make a misstatement. Obviously he was trying to belittle me and I was having none of it. I was trying to be helpful even if I don't carry a greasy rag around in my pocket.

EVERYTHING I said about the 2.4 engine is fact. You can take it to the bank; unless of course you believe the Kia manual is lying (and I'm looking at it as I type this) and I'm lying to hear my head rattle. It takes EXACTLY 5 quarts of oil at the angle I changed the oil. Exactly!

Note: The manual also states that the 2.0 engine uses 4.1 quarts of U.S. measured oil. Evidently the oil pan must be somewhat smaller or some other explanation. But I speaking strictly to the 2.4 engine. I have the 2011 SX model. Wanna be precise. Still looking at the manual. Don't wanna be inaccurate or get anyone's dandruff up.
 

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Well since his statement was "The drain plug is 17mm. Hyundai does use a 14mm, but all Kias are universally 17mm since '02."
Can't get much clearer unless you need to see the word definitely. Your response to his response displayed much doubt that he knew what he was talking about. I was clarifying to you that his is a tech (I know where he works) and not someone that just used a forum name that makes it sound like they are a tech.
 

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Well since his statement was "The drain plug is 17mm. Hyundai does use a 14mm, but all Kias are universally 17mm since '02."
Can't get much clearer unless you need to see the word definitely. Your response to his response displayed much doubt that he knew what he was talking about. I was clarifying to you that his is a tech (I know where he works) and not someone that just used a forum name that makes it sound like they are a tech.
So your real beef with me is that I used the word "probably?." I apologize for my inadequacies with the king's English. I shouldn't have used it. I have subsequently correctly my sloppy language.

I never doubted that he was a tech and you are inferring that I didn't believe he was a tech. I'm not responsible for your inferences. I never doubted what he said. I was giving my personal experience over 50 years of working on vehicles myself although not professionally.

He started out by playing down the hockey puck idea. I NEVER said I did this but that I had seen it posited as an idea that on the surface appeared to have much merit which is the ONLY reason I even brought it up. I didn't expect to be ridiculed for it. But I can tell you for a certain fact that I once took a car in for service and the rocker panels were caved in and I had to raise Holy Hades to get it handled without me paying for it. And I'm sure we have all heard of these jackleg mechanics who work on cars who don't know a wrench from a bottle of beer who people cater to in order to save a little money. How many times have they changed oil only to leave out the oil plugs and engines were ruined? I would never in a thousand years take my car to have its oil changed at one of these quick change stations for this very reason. They will ALWAYS blame it on the owner but never take responsibility. That's something you can also take to the bank.
 

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The dealer I go to has a filter display that shows the cutaway of the Kia filter and I haven't been able to confirm it but the service guy said he was told it was a Mobil 1 filter rebranded for Kia. Maybe KiaTech will know or be able to find out who makes the filter for Kia.

Is there a good spot for a floor jack and a couple jack stands under the Forte? I had the dealer do my first oil change and haven't looked underneath since it was on the lift.
 

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The dealer I go to has a filter display that shows the cutaway of the Kia filter and I haven't been able to confirm it but the service guy said he was told it was a Mobil 1 filter rebranded for Kia. Maybe KiaTech will know or be able to find out who makes the filter for Kia.

Is there a good spot for a floor jack and a couple jack stands under the Forte? I had the dealer do my first oil change and haven't looked underneath since it was on the lift.
I always refer to this oil filter study to see the construction of oil filters. I think most people will find it quite interesting.

Engine Oil Filter Study

I must be frank in that I am extremely reluctant to put floor jacks under a car unless I know precisely where to place them.

If one takes their car to the mass tire sellers they use a full car length arrangement that arranges virtually the entire length of the car on a long stretch of the hydraulic jack arrangement. The one that "bit" me was the kind that extended outward and the stupid mechanic didn't bother to check that it contacted the rocker panels and several hundred dollars of damage was done. When I took it back to the store, it was explained to me that this was his "crack" mechanic who had been with him for years and never could make such an idiotic mistake. I had to convince him with a rather disagreeable argument that I damned sure didn't bring it into his store with bent rocker panels. His insurance finally coughed up the cost of straightening and repainting the rocker panels. (This was on a Ranger pickup).

I would get very specific instructions and mean very specific instructions where the safe jack points are to use with jack stands or a floor jack. Even if you use a jack stand you must never, never, never, get under a car assuming that you have redundancy built in so the car can't fall on you and that it is properly balanced. More than a few cars have fallen of of these hydraulic affairs because people got into a big rush.

The safest and virtually foolproof way to get under a car is with the wheels blocked and in the trough of a metal ramp and where the car cannot possibly move. Shake it if necessary and if there is any question don't get under the car. It isn't worth your life.

Note: In the olden days you could simply locate the separate frame and put the jack stands under those cars with relative safety. Most pick-ups and the phased out Ford Crown Victorias have separate frames which are favored by the police forces and taxi companies because it is easier to change out body panels after accidents and do not generally require specialized jigs to straighten out an entire car "frame" that virtually all cars have today. These cars are very easy to work on because frame members are readily available to fit inside the "cup" of the jack stands. But then you need to have very good (and expensive) floor jacks, not the $20 cheap jacks at Wal-Mart.

Perhaps one of the techs can come on here and give some tips about where to do this. The manual provides the lift points to use with the 2 cent scissor jacks they include with these vehicles but it tends to be vague. I take it is about a six inch stretch toward the front and back wheel wells. Other than those I don't know where you could put a jack stand safely.
 

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I use Rhino ramp to raise the front end, which helps with the oil drain. For the drain nut, adjustable wrench works for me. The steel cap oil filter tool helps to loosen the filter if it's on too tight. The oem filter and crush gasket are purchased from the dealer (Kia or Hyundai) since the part numbers are exactly the same. One surprising fact is that the filter and the aluminum washer are cheaper if purchased from Hyundai, at least around my area. 26300-35503 (filter), 21513-23001 (washer).
 

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Obviously he was trying to belittle me and I was having none of it. I was trying to be helpful even if I don't carry a greasy rag around in my pocket.
I am sorry you feel that was my intention. I certainly never intended to cast a doubt on your original post, or called anything you said incorrect. I simply pointed out that the notion of hockey pucks doing more than being slapped about on the ice as humorous. My intent was not to poke fun or draw your ire... it was only to explain why they seem a little excessive to me.

You took my tone as an indirect attack, apparently and decided to defend yourself with a direct attack on me. I do not appreciate this but I will apologize for your feelings being hurt, and will continue to post my experince and knowledge on the forum, as I feel it adds to the general knowledge of the board, and the community.

As for your 'exactly five quarts', you are correct in the "level surface vs. angled rearward" adding a 1/2 quart to the fill. However, it has been my experience that the most oil I have ever put into a Theta engine has been 4.2L, which is equivalent to 4.5 quarts (ish). The average drain and fill with filter is 3.8-4.0L, with every engine being slightly different (attributed in my mind to differences in reading the stick vs. time for oil to settle to the pan, etc). 0.2 of a litre is a small cup of coffee... lots of places for that to hide in an engine.

So I'll admit that yes, if a Forte is leaning back while draining it's oil then it WILL drain 5.0 quarts (of whatever it is).

But by that same token: If you check the oil while the car is STILL in it's raised, leaning rearward position, then the stick will read LOWER than the actual oil level, due to the stick reading the level at the front side of the pan.

So it's pretty clear to me (and a few hundred other readers) that you may have overfilled your oil.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Ok, first off I gotta comment on the hockey puck idea... that's precious. Um.. let's put it nicely and just say "that's not required as long as you jack on something stable". A good suggestion is to jack on the subframe at any point... but avoid the control arms, and any tie-rods, steering linkage, sway bar, etc. Chances are that if you don't know what the difference between a subframe and a control arm, you should NOT be changing your own oil. A hockey puck isn't going to make any difference at all, other than make you look silly to anyone who asks what you're doing.

The drain plug is 17mm. Hyundai does use a 14mm, but all Kias are universally 17mm since '02.

There is a whole ton of room around the oil filter to reach up and grab it with your hand. No cut out, no access hole. The Forte has a lot less undercar plastics than a lot of other cars, so nothing really in your way. The catch is that it IS a bit of a wider filter, and you WILL need pliers/claw/band wrench/etc to remove it if it's your first service. Filters are put on 'dry' at the factory and they are sticky as hell to get off. Trying by hand is an exercise in futility for most people. The Kia filter is 3 1/4" wide, so make sure your tool can manage it.

When tightening the drain plug use a fresh aluminum washer and tighten to hand tight, plus about 1/8 - 1/6 of a turn to snug it down. This isn't a competition to see who can squeeze the snot out of the washer, it's just tight enough to 'seat' it and let it do it's job. I find a 1/4 turn is way too much... just snug it up.

Otherwise... make sure you put oil back in (that's funny, because it happens a LOT) and don't slop it over the back of the engine on into the plug's well... again, happens a lot.

You'll find that a full change with filter will take about 3.5 - 4 quarts, depending on how long you wait for it to finish draining. If you need to put more than 4 quarts then check your drain plug and your counting - that oil's going somewhere 'else' or it's maybe just not flowing down into the pan as fast as you're pouring it into the top.
Thanks KiaTech....Very informative!!!!
 

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I am sorry you feel that was my intention. I certainly never intended to cast a doubt on your original post, or called anything you said incorrect. I simply pointed out that the notion of hockey pucks doing more than being slapped about on the ice as humorous. My intent was not to poke fun or draw your ire... it was only to explain why they seem a little excessive to me.

You took my tone as an indirect attack, apparently and decided to defend yourself with a direct attack on me. I do not appreciate this but I will apologize for your feelings being hurt, and will continue to post my experince and knowledge on the forum, as I feel it adds to the general knowledge of the board, and the community.

As for your 'exactly five quarts', you are correct in the "level surface vs. angled rearward" adding a 1/2 quart to the fill. However, it has been my experience that the most oil I have ever put into a Theta engine has been 4.2L, which is equivalent to 4.5 quarts (ish). The average drain and fill with filter is 3.8-4.0L, with every engine being slightly different (attributed in my mind to differences in reading the stick vs. time for oil to settle to the pan, etc). 0.2 of a litre is a small cup of coffee... lots of places for that to hide in an engine.

So I'll admit that yes, if a Forte is leaning back while draining it's oil then it WILL drain 5.0 quarts (of whatever it is).

But by that same token: If you check the oil while the car is STILL in it's raised, leaning rearward position, then the stick will read LOWER than the actual oil level, due to the stick reading the level at the front side of the pan.

So it's pretty clear to me (and a few hundred other readers) that you may have overfilled your oil.
OK, You're absolutely right. I may have overfilled my oil. But, just to be sure, I check the oil level on my enclosed garage floor. I just took a five foot carpenter's level and it is exactly flat. Now the last time the oil was changed it was at the Hyundai dealer so I have no way to know how much oil they used although they obviously used the Hyundai oil filter. It is not due for an oil change so it's a mute point for now.

However, I have rechecked the oil level overnight after all the oil has drained into the crankcase after I have changed my own oil because I had these concerns not to overfill the crankcase. I am aware of the potentiality of the foaming problem if a crankcase is overfilled so I am very careful about this.

It is true that on the ramp and on my driveway it is several degrees downward so I initially held back a half quart of oil and then pulled the car into my garage where it sits overnight and I found that the oil was below the full mark. When I add the remaining oil using a funnel so I can get every drop in it, it is then at the full mark. I also check it the next day in the event that not all the oil drained down the previous day. The oil is still at the full mark and not over the full mark.

All I am saying is that is my experience. I HAD expected that when I put the 4.5 quarts of oil into the engine while on the ramps it would fill nearly to the top of the dipstick. Since a half quart is not critical and within the safety margin I proceed to move it off the ram to a lesser incline but not completely level driveway. But I still noticed that it is not up to the top of the dipstick. I can only assume that the remaining oil is approximately 1/2 quart in a flat position where the oil change technician changes the oil and as I'm sure you know they turn out a lot of oil changes each day; especially on the $19.95 days. Next time I am at the dealer I am going to pick the service manager's head and find out precisely how much the mechanic puts into the engine. Then I will get back to you.

Just as a further FYI, I just checked the Forte and it shows exactly full at the dot on the dipstick, as one would expect with a new car. I am guessing it came that way from the factory in Korea. I also checked the Hyundai which last had its oil changed about 1,500 miles ago and it sits alongside the Kia and it too had the oil level exactly at full.

The bottom line is that if the car is tipped using the ramps there will be more oil that will drain from the engine. That was my point. If I were to change using the procedure employed by the dealer I would of course adhere to the amounts specified in the manual.
 

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Referring to a floor jack and jack stands. I have used this on previous cars where I found sturdy frame material to support on the stands. Jack stands are not hydraulic but the jack is and safety is the reason for the jack stands rather than trust a hydraulic floor jack with my body on the line. For the Forte there might not be a good spot for the jack and jack stands.

I was also considering the Rhino ramps like recommended by sspak9 so I think I will get a set. I will get the 12,000 lb ones and the wheel chalks. In my case I want a pickup again some day so the heavier duty ramps sound better to me.

As far as the oil fill comments here I would agree the amount needed could vary a bit due to how much drained out. How much I don't know but if the level is checked with the dipstick while the car and the surface is level it should be good.
 

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While on the oil change subject what oil do some of you recommend. I plan to use Amsoil but will most likely use the Kia filter and crush gasket.

I looked at the Oil filter study and have seen it in the past. It is very informative but still leave me with the question of which company makes the Kia filters?
 

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This time I went with pennzoil ultra synthetic and a mobil 1 filter, also mobil 1 synthetic gear oil. last time ran royal purple with a k&n
not really any noticeable difference except for price lol
rp is $10 more a quart for the gear oil, and the oil came out to be $12 more for 5 qts
the k&n filter (made by mobil 1) is $1 more
 

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I use hockey pucks on all my jacks... not for stability... but to prevent the jack from grinding off the paint from the sub-frame...
 

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I agree with missourimule. The 2.4 litre in Forte SX, when using ramps to change the oil and KIA filter, takes a full 5 quarts. I've changed the oil twice now and it has used the full 5 quart jug. Both times I've put in 4.5 quarts and then start it while it was on the ramps and check for leaks. I then back it off the ramps and let it sit for five or ten minutes to drain back down and check the oil level again and It's a half quart low. I then empty the jug of the other half quart and it is right to the full line. The garage floor is is level so that is not an issue.

FYI: It is a 17mm drain plug on the forte 2.4 liter ...at least on mine.
 
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